Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-34798955-20180310144518/@comment-34645353-20180314132559

TheHumanAmbassador wrote: "Frisk and Chara are not the ones to kill, though. It is the player who corrupts them both. I never said Frisk corrupts Chara, I said the player did. You are not Frisk. Frisk is their own person."

No, I am most certainly Frisk when I play. Filled with determination, the one capable of saving and loading. Of course, I mean us, who play the game, not the title of "player", which is just given to the one who can SAVE and LOAD in general, i.e-Flowey. To not get the two mixed up, I just say Frisk when I mean us.

"That is not why I think they laughed. They were laughing their pain away. A whole lot of characters do this. I believe they wanted to free all monsters, not kill every last human. Asriel may have 'betrayed' them, but I think Chara knew it was because he didn't want to kill the humans anymore."

Then why did they do the whole dead body thing? Do note, that I didn't consider this an evil action, but rather, simply stemming from Chara's hatred of humanity. It even explains the whole dead body thing-Chara was trying to prove a point to Asriel about humans!

"Most of your reasoning is behind the fact that you think by the player I meant Frisk. I didn't. I meant the person actually playing the game."

Which is canonically one and the same as Frisk. Just like the player is canonically the main character in every other game ever... Except for OneShot. We don't go around saying the player isn't the same as Link now, do we? Sure, there's references to doing things a player would do, but those apply to Flowey as well, doing the exact same thing. I mean, if we could save and load in real life, what's to say we WOULDN'T start playing with the world like a game? Flowey did it, Frisk did it. And Sans calls us/Frisk out on it. By the way, this is why I call "player" a title here. When Flowey was the "player", he was just like us-He had his own HUD, his SAVE files.. His stat screens..

"They help you on your quest because YOU, the player, are corrupting them into believing killing is good and you want power. They want the Genocide after you already have started genocide and are already starting to become corrupted."

We're a HUMAN. Chara should be trying to stop us.

"Anyway, Chara wouldn't trust Frisk at first, but if they spare the monsters they start to realize that maybe this human is okay. On a Genocide run, they are stuck with you and can't stop watching you kill everyone through determnation."

Solution:Get Frisk killed!

"So the corruption starts, and they start helping you."

So they realize you're evil, and they don't like you.. So.. They help you? ...That doesn't make sense.

"But on a pacifist route, they help you. They make puns. When you die, they tell you to stay determined."

No, we get a memory of Chara because Chara is tied to Frisk, as an intangible ghost, also known as:The narrator. If Asriel can feel the feelings of all the monsters by absorbing them, why can't we feel the feelings of Chara by absorbing their essence, forever tying them to us?

"They do tell you to stay determined on a genocide, but it is, again, because of their corruption."

Or, they don't, because I realized if Chara's not doing it in Pacifist, they're not doing it in Genocide either. They instead just tell you to kill everything like you're doing, like in the Waterfall and Snowdin scenes.

"I'm not saying Chara is completely innocent. Frisk isn't innocent on the Genocide run, as they start doing actions on their own that are pretty bad. Chara was willing to kill humans to free monsters."

At FIRST. And yes, Frisk isn't innocent. A lot of the people really do like to blame ALL their actions on Chara just because they're a part of it. Guys, Chara may be evil, but.. Who's the one killing like 95% of the monsters?

"Also, who is to say Chara even pressed the fight button for Sans and Asgore, anyway? It could have been Frisk. Nobody really knows for sure."

...It wasn't Frisk. We're Frisk. Also, we don't gain EXP from Asgore. Flowey literally tells you to let Frisk be happy at the end of True Pacifist. So, you are not Frisk. You control Frisk, but you are not Frisk. Flowey was once like the player, but he wasn't controlling anyone (he manipulated, but not physically controlled).

Yes, Chara most likely was showing Asriel that humans were bad, so it was okay to collect their souls. They knew that Asriel wouldn't collect the souls of innocent humans if they did nothing back. I don't think Chara thought they were going to die, and wouldn't have done that if they knew. That was bad, but good people make mistakes.

Chara can't stop you. They can only watch you kill everyone. Until they gain 20 LV, that is, and have more determination. And by then they're corrupted and evil because of what you did to them and the Underground. You can't get Frisk killed because they resurrect.

They start helping you because they are turning evil. They realize they can't stop you and, because they are turning evil from your actions, they start helping.

The memory of staying determined is from Chara, when Asgore told them to stay determined while they were dying. You don't really... 'absorb'... their essence. Frisk and Chara are stuck together through determination. But you aare not absorbing Chara. Asriel felt all of the monsters feeling because he literally absorbed their souls. You didn't absorb Chara's soul. Chara tells you to stay determined, on either route, because they want to help. On Genocide because they are turning evil and can't stop you and on True Pacifist because they love the monsters and want to free them, which was their plan all along.

Chara is innocent until YOU complete Genocide. They are corrupted by your actions forever. Therefore, they are evil at that time, but it isn't their fault. You corrupted them. You made them evil. Frisk doesn't, since you aren't Frisk. Chara doesn't corrupt themself. Chara gained all of that EXP the whole time. It's possible we DID gain EXP from Asgore, but it didn't show since Chara didn't care to inform you, since it wasn't a battle. It just might not had been enough to level us up.