Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-26006155-20190403163405/@comment-32182236-20190411125038

Flowey's ability to save and load cannot simply be because of his determination injection. Because Undyne has second-hand determination, but was unable to save and load herself. She had determination from a human soul.. but did not have an actual human soul herself.

Alphys's DT experiments on Flowey pre-dates her moving onto the Garbage dump and her current science "projects"-That was back when the True Lab was still active. Undyne doesn't have SLR specifically because Flowey had it first, and has more DT than Undyne.

It is possible that Chara's horrific betrayal of Asriel, a violation of their childhood friendship and a trust of the most intimate type possible, damaged ASRIEL in the same way that Chara herself was injured in her village.

Why can't the fact that Asriel died, with his SOUL turning into dust be the damage? Asriel still looks up to Chara, even as Flowey. Asriel clearly doesn't see this as a betrayal by Chara. But Chara trying to get him to fight. To see the humans as what they are. (From Chara's warped perspective)

Chara isn't a monster, she's horribly damaged. But from her perspective, she thinks her current view of the world is right. That the World IS a horrible place where it's Kill Or Be Killed, and so it's totally ok for her to kill others, or make them suffer until they wished they were dead.

You got that exactly right. But they didn't do that to the Dreemurr Family.. they could have took Asriel's Boss Monster SOUL. So, why didn't they do that?

They did have love for the Dreemurrs. It's just that said love wasn't enough to overpower their hatred for humanity.

As for after their death? That's a whole different story.

Just being human doesn't make you a monster. It's what you do with that power that does.

Exactly. Chara just doesn't get that.

Something happened when she was ten or so, that made her want to kill herself. She didn't want to kill herself from birth, or when she was 2, or 5, or 7. It happened when she was TEN.

Where'd you get that age from? In your entire script, you only mentioned ten years specifically when talking about how long Jeff was in boarding school for.

However, this doesn't explain why Flowey woke up with only one voice inside him rather than two. Or how the single soul he possessed was able to mimic the human functions of saving and loading.

He didn't have a SOUL. That one voice was his own.

PROVE this is the case! Why does Sans look the same, and how was he able to teleport Grillby's up from the Underground that, if this isn't the same world, shouldn't exist?

He's a skeleton. Why would he look different? And hasn't Sans been analyzing the timelines? The ones jumping left and right, stopping and starting? Undyne never met Alphys, so it'd have to be a prequel. Yet the monsters are on the Surface, and Gerson is dead, so it'd have to be a sequel. And it can't be both. Putting Deltarune on the timeline is literally impossible. If you think you can do it, go on and try.. I challenge you.

Oh, and here's an FAQ by Toby Fox. Read the first question or two. https://www.deltarune.com/help/

But I can go further! I can prove that not only is this a different timeline, but it's a different world entirely! And this time, WITHOUT relying on Toby Fox at all!

Saving.. We all know what it is, right? The power given to you by determination. When you're filled with determination, you can SAVE. Simple, right?

So, let's move onto Deltarune. The familiar stars are back, but strangely, they're another color. Well, I suppose this is the Dark World, after all. Either way, let's stay determined and-

Wait.. Shine? That's not determination! Saving doesn't even work the same way! The rules are different, too!

Plus, the red SOUL is our SOUL, that we created with the help of Gaster at the very start of the game. (I mean the VERY start. Before Kris wakes up) Kris was naturally SOULless, while still being alive, and we artificially created a SOUL. Despite it being impossible based on Alphys' entries.

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And besides this unnatural desire to destroy herself, it also led to her betraying the Dreemur Family, some of the nicest creatures in the world, because she valued revenge on her home village, and the humanity that she hated, more than their love for her.

Did you click that link? I told you, Chara didn't jump, they fell! They weren't going to kill themselves!

They likely wanted to run away from humanity instead. Or meet those monsters that the humans didn't want anyone to see anymore.

And besides this unnatural desire to destroy herself, it also led to her betraying the Dreemur Family, some of the nicest creatures in the world, because she valued revenge on her home village, and the humanity that she hated, more than their love for her.

From their perspective, it was the exact reverse. They were trying to get Asriel to realize the evilness of humanity (from their warped perspective, humanity isn't evil), and get him to kill them. Asriel refused, and ended up getting the both of them killed. So from Chara's perspective, Asriel valued the life of humanity more than his love for them. From Chara's perspective, Asriel was the one betraying Chara. (But of course, Asriel wasn't betraying Chara.) This is why they lash out in such anger when they finally meet Flowey again in Genocide, killing him in several blows when they could have just one-shotted him like everyone else.

Part of the reason Hyperdeath Asriel stopped playing around and blasted Frisk full in the face with a Kamehameha is that Asriel started to realize that all the people he had hurt was NOT OK... and he tried to destroy the messenger, rather than face the reality of that message.

He was going to reset, and bring everything back to zero. But Frisk was determined. To Asriel, likely annoyingly determined.

But yes, we did end up healing Asriel then.