Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-26905610-20160225224529/@comment-26347196-20160226025043

Well, I guess I'm here to probably prove otherwise. Yes, I don't see him as a cute teddy bear kind of character, but no, I see him as a rather tragic character, and believe me when he had almost zero redemption.

First, Asgore vs. Chara. I believe when Asgore said "What kind of monster are you?" he definitely don't consider the protagonist as Chara - he knows Chara is long gone, but more importantly, he don't consider Chara as a monster, because Chara is his adopted child, who he loves to no end.

Second, he doesn't really know that time resets when he kills you. Now, before you say that he and mostly others did, since he said "Ready?" instead of long descriptive lines about the barrier, I want to reconfirm one fact that not all people is aware of the shirt in timeline, except for Sans, Flowey and Chara. All others only remember a slight whiff of memory in the previous timeline, and perhaps Mettaton and Asgore both have lingering memories of having explained things, in which they prompt to skip the long talk.

Third, when you say that Asgore don't give up on violence, it's because he couldn't. Especially when he is a king. Catch to me on this: in the underground, and given such plans by Asgore, everyone is eager for the king to get enough human souls to break the barrier. And this is where it dreads Asgore as soon as he sees a human:


 * If he lose the fight, he will lose his soul, in which is ripe for the protagonist to use as they cross the barrier, and, at the same time, fail to fulfill the promise he made to the underground. It's evident in the Neutral route: even with the 6 humans souls, no one actually really carry on Asgore's will except fo Undyne, But then in reality, all 6 human souls are gone, and Toriel would probably prevent the human from dealing with Undyne by then.


 * If he wins the fight, he will steal the human's soul and help the underground cross the barrier. The new problem arises: they will face the human once again, in which the humans, who knows, see the monsters and attempted to seal them back in once again.

I mean, with what plan he had made, he's basically very stuck. Furthermore, he had 6 human souls already; he can't back out of such work.

Now, none of the characters are flawless, and this is where Asgore have done goofed.

In the Neutral route, and even the Pacifist, both Frisk (when you choose Mercy) and Toriel do not want this to happen. Toriel simply prevents both from killing one each other to let the other pass, because it's her true aim. When Frisk spare him, it is implied from Asgore that Frisk wants to stay here and be with the people in the underground.

This is where I might need you to think for me, because I'm not sure what plan is the best to free people out of the underground (apart from the True Pacifist route, because that would be something that Asgore would not expect to happen at all). Imo, Asgore is probably a coward, but, this is possibly the plan that minimizes Asgore's amount of violence caused.

Also, back to the present (in the sense of a neutral route). I think Asgore is actually in deep deep anguish as well. Even if Flowey is not present to end Asgore (not his soul), he ended his own life, just because he said he don't deserve a happy ending.

In the end, I think this guy needs a buttload of help, something that only True Pacifist route can save him.