Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-26006155-20181123023529/@comment-32182236-20181226134905

...You didn't fix the mystery holes at the end. Well, I suppose now's the time for me to reveal it for all to see! (Especially you, Ferret.)

Well, not yet. I still have a little more deconstruction to do.

But first, a reconstruction. Turns out, Flowey's timeline WOULD be altered, if Gaster was a human with a determination SOUL. He'd never be able to reset, meaning that he'd actually simply die for good when he tried to kill himself for the first time. So it seems that universes 1-4 end up becoming identical to 5-8 once Flowey dies. So, in 1-4, Gaster CANNOT have a determination SOUL. In 5-8, he CAN. (This creates universes 9-12, in which case Flowey was made, but died since he couldn't reload when he later would in Timeline Gamma. These might seem useless, but it makes a new possibility for Gaster's backstory.)

However, for 1-4 to even be possible at all, Flowey must have more determination than a non-DT SOUL human. (Since Gaster would be one of them.) If none of the fallen could S/L/R, this is proven, but if not, this is not very likely. I'll leave it in, though, since even the unlikely is still possible, and I don't want to eliminate all but that one, and then say that means your theory is impossible.

---Loading Universe 1A---

Flowey:Say.. What if I told you.. I knew some way to get a better ending? You'll have to LOAD your SAVE file, and..

Flowey:Well, in the meantime, why don't you see Dr. Gaster? Perhaps he's the key to your happiness?

---

Seems 1A looks a little promising right now. (Reasoning:Alphys didn't work with Gaster, so only Gaster would be at the True Lab. Alphys is therefore useless in getting TP. Gaster, on the other hand..)

Given how not-insecure Gaster really is, he probably wouldn't let Frisk into the True Lab.. UNLESS it was actually to show him something, or recruit him as his assistant. Even still, why isn't Flowey pushing things in the right direction, for his master plan? --

--Loading universe 1B--

Flowey:I've been thinking. Is killing things.. Really necessary?

Frisk:You know, I've been wondering that too. I couldn't find a way to spare those guards.. But maybe I missed something?

Flowey:Well, I want to see you prove that. Get here.. Without killing a single thing... and I won't kill the king.

(If Frisk succeeds, then we get to the same situation as 1A. If they fail, their execution points remain, so once again, why wait until after Gaster's fall to say you lack the purity needed?)

--

2A and 2B are identical to 1A in this regard. So I'll just skip to 3A.

---Loading universe 3A..---

Flowey:Flowey:Say.. What if I told you.. I knew some way to get a better ending? You'll have to LOAD your SAVE file, and..

Flowey:Well, in the meantime, why don't you see Dr. Alphys? Perhaps she's the key to your happiness?

(Well, we get the question I asked before. Why didn't a TP happen here? Hopefully, this should help you choose a universe, and thus, get some info on what properties the Alpha Timeline most likely had.) -

3B is mostly identical to 1B, except Frisk succeeding in not killing anyone leads to 3A instead of 1A. Universes 4A and 4B are identical to 3A in this regard as well.

--Loading universe 5A/9A--

Asgore:Please.. take my SOUL, and seek the truth.. *damages himself*

Asgore:I'm sorry.. I couldn't give you a simple, happy ending. But I believe your freedom.. is what my son... ASRIEL... would have wanted... *dies*

--Outcome 1--

Frisk:..I just can't do this.. I have to find a better ending.. --RESET--

(Frisk either succeeds in getting a TP, which eliminates your theory, or they fail again. It is here where they probably meet Gaster, but you have to explain how, why they gave up, and also why Outcome 2 didn't happen instead when Frisk gave up)

--Outcome 2--

Frisk:I suppose I have no choice.. He's already dead, and this is what he wants.. *absorbs the monster SOUL, and crosses the Barrier*

--

In fact, in ALL of the universes beyond this, it ends with Asgore killing himself, and Frisk making a choice like the one described. Though this time, he may or may not have been forced to kill monsters. If they were forced to kill monsters, though, once again, Frisk would probably either look for ways not to, or, if they give up, go with the best possible ending they CAN get. ..So tell me.. What triggered the shift? Why did Frisk seek out Gaster, become Sans, and start with all the experiments? If Frisk is still underground, Asgore is still dead. In EVERY universe. So go on, show us what happened post-Neutral Ending. (In the Alpha timeline, of course.)

---

No, these aren't the mystery holes. Haven't gotten there yet. But that's still a lot of holes! Luckily for you, you only need to fix the holes in ONE of the universes:The universe you believe to be the "true" universe. (Though if you want to tackle multiple because you're agnostic about which one is the real one, or want to have another if I end up destroying your current main universe, then go on!)