Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-26006155-20181123023529/@comment-32182236-20181203173132

Alright, let's get back to my cross-examination.

--Cross-Exam--

Actually, since the next set of parapgraphs merely repeat the same few arguments, I'll just respond to the arguments directly.

So, the first thing you seem to argue is that since no evidence exists that someone else could have died around the time of 201X, the statue must be of Gaster. But here's the question:Why does it have to be around the time of 201X? 201X was the time when the monsters made a mass movement from the Ruins to New Home, which is why Toriel's calendar is stuck at early 201X. That means the memorial fountain could have begun construction as soon as they even made it to New Home. There's no reason why the fountain can't be a memorial of someone who died far earlier, like perhaps in the War of Humans and Monsters, or perhaps even earlier than that, back when the Delta Rune's meaning was still well-known.

Speaking of that, that gives us an interesting note. In the intro, the very first image. the Boss Monster is wearing the Delta Rune emblem. It seems as though even before the war, the prophecy was still a thing. Which means the monsters actually KNEW they were going to eventually get sealed.. And decided they would use that as their royal emblem.. I wonder how much SP* we gained from that little detail..

*No, it doesn't stand for Special Points. It stands for our trademark that Mettaton now owns. Story Potential(TM)

By the way, why does it have to be someone nobody really likes all that much anymore compared to the other Royals because Mettaton took over? None of the other members of royalty have a memorial either. Could just be that Mettaton overtook EVERYBODY.

And the ancient statue in Waterfall still plays Asriel's theme. So either there was a sexond statue in between Asriel's and Mettaton's, or whoever made the music box was prophetic.

So, next you argue once again that Chara and Asriel grew for quite some time. Tell me, how do you know this? Why can't it be that Chara died less than a week after they fell into the Underground?

Yes, of course it wasn't to Toriel. Chara's more likely than Toriel, since as you stated, Toriel left AFTER the death of Chasriel.

Now, when it comes to Gaster's experiments, I believe there is a near-zero probability that stealing SOULs to break the Barrier is his goal. If that was his goal, he wasn't a brilliant scientist at all. Why do I say that? Because he'd need more SOULs than actually exist! All the monsters combined only give a little more than one human SOUL, and he needs the power of seven. So his plan would be literally impossible, even if he was human and added himself to make two.

However, if he was trying to make super powerful monsters, that would be far different. It's actually feasible. Alphys put in way too MUCH determination, and made some Amalgamtes. Now, if Alphys had spread all that DT around, giving everyone only a trace amount, like with Undyne, she could have made at least 100 super-powerful monsters! And so could Gaster!

However, I now have an alternate explanation for what he was doing. He was reseraching S/L/R. You see, once Chara fell, there was an anomaly in the timespace continuum. Timelines jumping left and right, starting and stopping.. Chara had the ability to S/L/R. (They had a red SOUL just like Frisk. Why WOULDN'T they have this ability?) Gaster and his assistant Sans got to work on buildig a machine, to analyze the timelines, looking for the nature of the anomaly. He'd find that each anomaly was linked with a sudden spike in DT around the area of Chara, the anomaly. This would be the first sign to him that the world is not what it seems..

By the way, Sans being Gaster's assistant is where he got the badge from according to my hypothesis.

So, he did some research. Speculation on the nature of the anomaly, watching Chara.. Eventually, though, Chara died, and then died again. (Buttercups, killed by a human.) But, he knew that determination was the cause of the anomaly.. He had to research more..

He'd extract determination, to study its nature. To find out just how DT can control the very fabric of time, to allow one to bring the entire world back to an earlier state of time! If he succeeded in recreating this anomaly, he might be able to bring things back to before the Barrier was created, and change the outcome of the war!

Soon, our next human fell. It was captured by Asgore, and now finally Gaster had a SOUL to experiment on. While its trait was not determination, it still had detemrination inside of it, and thus, could still be experimented on. So, he got to work. One SOUL might have not been enough, who knows. But if one wasn't enough, he'd wait for another, and eventually, he had enough!

(Technically, if he was a human, he could use his own SOUL for these purposes, rather than your original set of purposes as well.)

Experiment by experiment, Gaster learned more and more about the mysterious substance. And eventually, he was on the verge of finally figuring out HOW S/L/R actually works. And he eventually discovered the menu.. Which was also a void, like the void where Flowey's World takes place in, alongside his warning.

Dark, darker yet darker. The darkness keeps growing. Shadows cutting deeper.. This next experiment seems very, very interesting.. WHAT DO YOU TWO THINK?

The first person was clearly Sans. The second, may very well have been Alphys.

So, what was his next experiment? He'd try to recreate the anomalous ability for himself. But, not just that, he'd do it without the restrictions of there being one file at a time. He'd access whatever warp field one uses to LOAD save files, and travel freely across it. However.. Experiments went wrong. There was a malfunction during the process, blasting him into the CORE. But since te process had already begun, he was already partially in the field when he shattered. This caused him to shatter across all of time and space, rather than just staying in the present.

Now, to the Fallen.

The reason why Alphys wasn't able to extract the SOULs was because the bodies didn't turn into dust. The entries flat-out say that. And THAT was because the DT was making them persist, just like with Undyne. It's just far more powerful, and since it was way too much, they melted.

By the way, the burden of proof goes to you. You're making an extraordinary claim, that there is a SOUL theif stealing SOULs. I'm simply saying the plague was just a plague. (By the way, same species does not mean same age. They're likely older members of all the species that became Amalgamted.) It's the extraodinary claims that require extraordinary evidence. Now, only around, maybe 16 monsters were actually seem as Amalgamtes? That's actually a rather small amount when you take into consideration that at least 300 monsters much exist because that's the number of SOULs we can see radiating around Asriel when he breaks the barrier (There could be more, just off-screen). We also have to take into consideration that this didn't all happen at once. Alphys was asking families to bring in their Fallen monsters. So monsters that Fell before then, but hadn't died were still brought in, all at once. Taking all of this into consideration, the odds aren't as low as you might have tried to argue.

You know, maybe I should get back to cross-examination mode. The repeats aren't repeating anymore!

--Cross-Examination--

"Once again, if Old Age was the reason, the story goes nowhere."

OBJECTION!

Sorry, but Chekhov's Gun has already fired. These Amalgamtes were the reason as to why Alphys became the anxious, insecure person she is today, and the experiments explains Flowey's origins. So no, the story doesn't go nowhere. We get info out of this.

"Regardless of what form Mettaton might have been using (wasn’t he using EX for the first time during the fight?)"

Yes, EX preimered in his boss fight. But NEO is not the same form as EX. It also isn't very-well known. Everyone knows Mettaton by his rectangular form, not his NEO form.

Also, what's to say the identity wasn't kept in a Non-Dislosure Agreement? Mettaton wants some DRAMA!! He's saving that piece of information for the big finale, when he reveals that he hired everyone! If Muffet gave it away before then, the finale would be spoiled!

"Why would Sans load up on useless ketchup before what he must have known was The Ultimate Fight For His Life?"

Oh, please, I'm not saying it was right before the fight. All the ketchup he's had over the years piles up, doesn't it? He has no digestive system!

"And how would Sans know the mechanics of the HUD, unless he had actually been in Frisk’s shoes at one point?

I'll start with another question:How was Asgore able to smash the MERCY button if he didn't know about the HUD? If he did, does that make Asgore a future Frisk too?

Now I'll answer your question:Scientific research. Let's go back to Sans and Gaster, shall we?

So, while Gaster was mainly researching the nature of the anomaly itself, Sans, on the other hand, was more interested on what interface the human uses to make ise of the ability. He knew it wasn't just random based on spikes of DT, because it was easily controllable for the anomaly. And having already figured out from Gaster that the world is not what it seems, he set out to do further research.

One thing he was wondering is:Exactly WHY are fights turn-based? (He knew they were turn-based very easily, it's easy to spot the pattern that nobody ever attacks twice in a row.) Now, I have my own complex theory on how the HUD actually works, but I'll only say what's relevant here, alright?

A FIGHT is initated when a monster pulls the human's SOUL out of their body, and onto the battlefield. A human could also do this to themselves and attack a monster to accomplish this, which is how they could have started the war. Meanwhile, a human moves around their SOUL, using the magical fields of foir buttons to teleport their SOUL across them. They then "select" an option at will when their SOUL is there, through some kind of focus/act of will/force, and the option happens! (I have an explanation on HOW the option happens and WHY the buttons are required, but that's irrelevant.)

Now, Sans, being great at reading faces, would be able to notice that the human is focusing on a specific area on the battlefield, just before the action is taken. He'd also notion that the SOUL still has to be somewhere when it's the human's turn, even though it's invisible. Combining the two together, he'd deduce the SOUL is within these four main areas. He might have then experimented by attacking those places and observed damage, he might not have done that, we don't know. Then, of course, he calculated the time between the sign of selection, and the following mysterious damage that gets inflicted, noticing it's actually consistently the exact same amount of time. This allows him to calculate exactly when to dodge.

I can also explain why Sans was blind to Chara’s second attack, because this was the point where Frisk officially lost control, and since Sans wasn’t a future incarnation of CHARA, he could no longer dodge.

But Frisk was still AROUND. Frisk WITNESSED the second attack. So Sans would still have knolwedge that the attack was coming.