Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-26006155-20200107155350/@comment-26006155-20200116184706

Ambassador, that's why I distinguished between being infused with Determination.. and being *filled* with Determination. Undyne and the flowers that Alphys injected with Determination had a finite supply. They contained some of the power, but not the *source*. Frisk, meanwhile, is able to Fill himself with Determination (#catchphrase)  because he has a human soul, where Determination comes from. Flowey was able to actually fill himself with Determination when he thought he was about to. And Flowey can save and load, something that Undyne and the other creatures with 2nd-hand Determination seem unable to do. Only a human soul can save and load. And Flowey powers are evidence of that.

Asriel and Chara combined their souls. SOUL is an acrynom that we're not not 100% sure of yet. But since all of Frisk's friends were within Asriel's SOUL, Chara's soul would be in there as well. Flowey has all the powers of a human SOUL, yet doesn't believe that he has one. Perhaps a person can't sense their own soul, any more than a person can look themselves in the face without the help of a mirror? Or the circumstances of Asriel's ressurrection as a flower reset something, so Chara's soul became his own? I'm not sure we have enough clues to figure all of this out yet. But everything I see points to Asriel still having at least part of Chara's soul.

If Asriel has no soul at all, why is he still able to feel compassion even after giving all of the other souls up? Compassion comes from the soul. And Asriel is how he used to be, full of compassion.

Asriel had compassion for Chara. Chara, though, only seemed amused when she almost cause Asgore to die with the buttercups. And she does that Creepy Face Thing all the time. All this comes to a head when she lies to Asriel about her purpose in returning to the village, then things she can completely take over his body as if he were nothing than a toy to her, and always had been. Chara might be a good actress, but her actions in the Underground reveal she never had compassion for anyone. Not even herself.

Flowey absorbed most of Asriel/Chara's dust, but some of it also scattered elsewhere, to the other flowers that then semi-sentiently grew in places where they knew Chara's vessel, Frisk, would fall in the future. That's why I think Asriel has at least part of Chara's soul, but how exactly a partial soul can function after being scattered is still up in the air. It doesn't seem to stop Gaster, though.

The phrase "Compassion comes from the soul" is definitely there in the lore, I'd have to make a meticulous breakdown of Deltarune to know where.

... you don't think that post-Barrier Asriel staying compassionate things and taking compassionate actions is evidence that he can still feel compassion? How else does one express compassion, then?

Flowey was able to feel all sorts of emotions when he first woke up. He was frightened, and didn't know what had happened to him. He was frustrated that he couldn't feel compassion. He was angry when Frisk dodged the "love pellets". He was sad when he found that not even his mother could make him feel compasion again, and that trying to help people didn't help him feel, either. Flowey has exhibited every emotion in the spectrum.. except the one he wants, Compassion. So you're wrong about " He first called out to Asgore, and while he didn't feel any emotions, he still seemed to like Asgore."

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" We came to play Undertale SPECIFICALLY because it's an RPG where nobody has to die. Why would OUR soul be damaged?"

Because Undertale takes the Murder Hobo trope that's ubiquitous through virtually all RPGs, where monsters are just meaningless pinyatas full of gold and EXP with no other purpose than to be killed by us, and turns it on his head. Suddenly, Monsters Are People Too.

Most people, on their first playthrough of Undertale, don't know what to expect, and approach the game much the same way they are accustomed to: They don't think twice about killing monsters. And after Flowey's betrayal at the beginning, most view Toriel with suspicion at first.. only to realize.. too late.. that Toriel was a good person. Then they try to reload their save to undo it.. and Flowey mocks them for it. Something that happened to me, and one of the creepiest things I've evern seen in a video game.

We start Undertale by giving our own name to Chara, thinking that, like most RPGs, this is character that will represent us in the game. And in a twisted way.. that *is* what happens, although we learn about it after the fact. Chara is a Murder Hobo, just like we were at the start. And in playing the game, and teaching Narrator Chara that there is a better way to live, we save our own soul in the process.

We were already damaged, when we came here. Although we never knew that, until visiting the Underground, and learning that Monsters could be our best friends.