Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-31981697-20170722123329/@comment-32182236-20170830205643

1)He said he'd turn back into Flowey eventually. This isn't an effect that's not requring energy to maintain. Asriel said himself that he can't keep maintaining the form. In fact, when we reopen the game, he's back to Flowey! Perhaps because he used too much of it to turn into Hyperdeath form for a while?

2)That makes sense.. Which means the game Toby developed must ALSO be in the Undernet, thereby disproving that game being Undertale!! It was a game for the monsters to play, which means... Overtale? Uppertale? ...Maybe it's something like that.

3)Look directly under Papyrus. See the rectangle-shape that matches the shape of the tank? Okay, now look inside that rectangle, on the left half, in the middle. it's right there. And pretty much every device we have now will be outdated in a hundred years, just as stuff from 100 years ago is outdated now.

4)Actually, they ARE just a human. The reason why they can use these menus is because they have the most determination. Flowey was able to do this too, at one point. Chara also.

...Oh, you mean why Frisk was able to see it when FLOWEY had the power.. Well, we had the ability to SAVE and LOAD before, and we went to reload the SAVE file, since somehow the world crashed. But actually, we can't interact with said menu to Reset-Doing so will just force our selection onto "Continue". We don't really have any control over these mechanics anymore. Remember, Flowey has the power to remember SAVEs simply because he had that power once. So being able to see menus because we had the power to control them once isn't that farfetched.

Basically, whoever has the most determination is given the role of "The Player". That's the best I can do to explain what it is, as it's pretty close to the powers of an actual player. However, they cannot alter the code, because there is no "code". So all the abilities we've had throught the entire game? Flowey once had them too. *wink*

5)Napstablook shames himself, so he must be telling the trith either and actually agree with all the bad things he says about himself! ...See the problem? They are filled with guilt that the exagreeated what happened. The introduction is the game itself telling us what happened. It can't be from Chara, because Chara wasn't around during the war. (Where would they get the images of the war from?) It's an objective view on the war. You saw he wouldn't put them in there for us to question them, but he made it clear the monsters wrote them. Besides, I can use the same logic-Toby wouldn't create the intro for us to question it. Nothing in the intro has been proven wrong yet. What makes these ancient inscrptions more reliable than the game itself?

6)Aaron proves that monsters ARE aware that checks are happening. Try again. :3

7)I was using this to show that if we disregard the HUD for the reasons you gave, quantum mechanics would be disregarded too. To show that we can't just disregard the HUD, and say it's weird. Because so is quantum mechanics. And yes, I'm aware of a wave function collapse. But, under the rules you gave to show that we should just disregard the HUD, it doesn't make sense. A wave function collapse happening at the simple act of observing. Seems offly similar to the HUD changing style and mechanics by the simple act of a battle starting, doesn't it?

8)It's the name the HUD uses, and the names that would appear on their SAVE file if they had one. They're also the names the HUD will check to see if you're using the same name as them. Therefore, those are the "HUD" names.

Now, to answer a question that I seemed to completely forget to answer from a few posts ago-Naming Chara "Frisk". You see, naming Chara any name at all will change the very universe and backstory, so that Chara's name was ALWAYS said name. Second, we've already established that two people can't have the same name under the rules of the HUD. This is also the reason why monsters like "Froggit A" and "Froggit B" are named as such-To prevent two monsters from having the same name. So.. What about Frisk? Frisk's name is decided from the start, and we can't rename ourselves. So what happens if we, Frisk, happen to name someone else.. Our OWN name? It SHOULD be rejected, right? Well, Frisk had not been entered into the system of the HUD yet-In fact, the file is only set up AFTER Frisk enters in a name. Therefore, they aren't acknolwedged, and the name is allowed. And THAT is when things go wrong..

You see, after Chara is named Frisk, it's now Frisk's turn to join the system, and.. their name is already set to Frisk. There are now two Frisks, two characters with the same name. And that's a problem... There's a reason why it's against the rules. We already know that Chara's backstory is changed to account for what we name Chara, so that it was ALWAYS their name. The same would happen here, except.. There's already a Frisk, and there can't be two Frisks.. So, this second Frisk's backstory is ignored entirely, and now we live in a world without Chara... Or should I say Frisk? ...I'll just be simole and say without Chara, since that's basically what it is, even though their name is Frisk now..

9)All the magic within Undertale can be explained in one way or another. Sufficiently advanced technology is indistuingishable from magic. Though, this does call into question whether the "snow" in Hotland is even snow at all! It could be something else that LOOKS like snow. Also, a glitch is an error within the coding of a program. What could a glitch be without code that the universe is running on?

10)The same reason why Undyne's SOUL didn't do that if we kill her on a Neutral Run.

11)She was using the few as test subjects. We both agree that these experiments were after the 7th human fell (Counting Chara). She was probably planning on unleashing the power of all the monster SOULs plus the six human SOULs, just like Asriel eventually did. That would break the barrier. But, the experiments failed, and the Amalgamates happened.

12)Well, yeah, of course! Asgore was going to destroy humanity after they reached the Surface, so if more humans were underground during that point im time, they're going to die too!

13)Chara flat-out said tears rolled across our face. And yes, I agree that Frisk didn't cry. That's my point. Chara said we did, and we didn't. That's why we disagreed with Chara's narration. They disagreed with crying because they didn't actually cry. That make sense now?

14)I must have mispoken. It was the NEUTRAL Ending that Flowey spoke to Frisk-When he mentioned that there was a way to get a better ending. In the Pacifist Ending, it was to Chara, I haven't changed by stance on that. Also, why WOULDN'T he talk about Frisk in 3rd person while they're listening? I don't see a problem. Chara was not separated from Frisk at all, that's why we're even able to see the cutscene at all! Why we can listen into their conversation! Also, why should we assume the narrator can't be heard by others anyway? What's wrong with saying they CAN? And why can't we use that as an explanation for Flowey talking about said narrator? Do note that Chara's doing the checking, why would they know that a check was being done if they couldn't see Chara doing it? Why would it look like Frisk was doing something they didn't do?

Except it's not the "game"'s menu, it's the WORLD'S menu, that Flowey has used as well. Also, pretty early on, I ended up proving he DID activate the HUD. I was trying to prove that the HUD was activated because Sans used an attack on Frisk, while you were making the claim that his attack WAS activating the HUD directly-With no cause. I do agree that the HUD was activated when Sans made the screen turn black, but he did something else too, to make us go blind, as we can't see our SOUL. The HUD activated as a response to that.

As for Flowey popping out, that wasn't the battle interface showing up. It was Flowey appearing before we access the menu to return to the Underground. We were basically in whatever weird void that the menu is contained within.

Also, Flowey speaking to Chara does NOT mean he is speaking to Frisk. That makes no sense whatsoever. He's LOOKING at Frisk, yes, but his words were meant for CHARA. It's like if there were three of us in the same room, and I spoke to one of you with the other around. Am I talking to the second person? Of course not, but they can still hear the conversation! Same thing here! And yes, Frisk DOES hear the conversation. That's how we get to see it in the first place, we're playing as Frisk, not Chara! If Frisk DIDN'T hear the conversation, we wouldn't get to see that cutscene!