Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-34798955-20180310144518/@comment-39637446-20190530171704

Dammit I fell asleep on the keys. I understand that they're not the two main points that emcompass all your opinions. But I do feel they are the main points with enough evidence. From even the Genocidal route I don't see Chara as being upset at Asriel for "betraying her". The way the story unfolds she just kills everyone who is disagreeing with her or in her way. (End of geno) She kills flowey(Asriel) brutally because he was trying to stop her by going to Asgore and obviously trying to double cross her. Heck she even destroys "us" because we want to keep the world in a different state as shed want.

To interpret whether Chara is "good" or "evil", we need to understand the overall message Toby is trying to portray. He does a very good job of showing how character personas aren't black or white, they make mistakes, they learn, and they change. Even Papyrus and Sans mention this during their respective fights- Geno route. In my opinion trying to argue on whether Chara is ultimately good or evil does a huge disservice to the message that Toby is conveying with this game. I don't see why he'd go off protocol for one of the major characters in the game. I don't blame the people having this debate and all sides have good arguments, because we dont't discuss with Chara. Heck, we are not even 100% sure the narrator is Chara! But, think about it this game does not have a single real antagonist! The best reason to play the Geno route is so we can get an insight on who she is, but being a corrupted player we can only form corrupted opinions on her. The Geno-route still only provides neutral information onto what kind of person Chara is. ( Her family portrait, her drawing, her bed etc.) It just doesnt make sense to me that Toby would make an exception to his predictable characterization just to punish the player. Even at the end Chara is not a textbook evil entity, she questions our choices. If anything Flowey had more evil in him than Chara. He actually SAID things that were super disturbing and even he was capable of change.

Just like most characters in the game (maybe even all characters in the game). Chara is also a confused and has her "valid" reasons for why she did the horrible things she did. Her poor judgement & detremination to follow that judgement led to both her's and her brother's death. She too as a character deserved the mercy and deserved to be shown the "good" path just like all other characters. [Opinion not fact] Maybe, that's why Asriel claims that Frisk is not Chara (Pacifist). Just like how being LV 20 ends up with Chara taking over "Frisk", going to the last part of the pacifist route puts her soul to rest. She does't need to stay anymore, her fight doesn't matter anymore. We've shown her that NOT ALL HUMANS ARE BAD.

From all the pieces of the puzzle (mainly the tapes and Ariel's epilogue), Chara was opportunistic and did what she had to do for her death to not be in vain. She took her body and left for the surface to attack her hometown. She was not mentally in a good place and she didn't expect Asriel to resist. When he resisted, I don't think she attempted to retake control and make him do something he did not want to do. She was too consumed with proving that humans are bad that she did not factor for what her decision would do to Asriel. She quits after being overpowered by Asriel. They both die putting her empty soul in this limbo because she has unfinished buisness and is racked with guilt (Which is why we even have the neutral and pacifist option). Even here, I am not saying Chara is good, but I am not saying Chara is resentful at Asriel or that Chara is just waiting for a cruel human to show up to complete her agenda (Which doesn't make sense bc she hates humans not monsters).

Also note that at the end of the Geno route, she doesn't go and bludgeon every human as we did to the monsters. She simply poof! erases the whole universe (plot hole:: is she really that OP? i think this is to be taken at face value). It's a way of being like okay buddy play time is over, i'll take the controls away from you you're too much like Flowey.

But then again what do I know, maybe Toby did mean for her to be a sociopath to put us in our place after a Geno run . Only the game developpers know. ;)

Thank you for reading <3