Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-31371445-20170222233857/@comment-27136653-20180720172305

"Correct-Because THOSE bullets are meant to be within the card:Not get shot right at the monsters' SOUL. Seriously, this is basic stuff."

Yeah. I don't think any parent would allow their child to go nearby something that could kill them. That's over the top irresponsible. It's conclusive, monsters express themselves through magic, which means magic doesn't always need to harm them.

"But the attacks wouldn't be aimed right at the SOUL."

Well, for some, the attacks were flying all over the place, they weren't all aimed directly at your soul. But that's still a pointless argument, because there's only so much space inside the box. Where exactly is the dividing border between a directed and a non-directed attack?

"You sure about that, Tsskyx?"

Yes, I am 100% sure about that. Why did Toby make monsters so nice? Also, pay attention to context, the line you brought up straight up proves all of this:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6gS2LPXdIc5VFJ5ZmRVM3ptcmM/view https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6gS2LPXdIc5VnpRcmhpRlZubXc/view https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6gS2LPXdIc5cE1XWW9wZ0NXNkk/view

"First, the fact that they may attack already implies that the general population would know what a human looks like."

Or it could mean that one out of every 30 monsters is going to attack you. We have no way of knowing just from the word "may". It could indicate a low probability, as well as a high probability expressed via a milder word.

"By definition, a FIGHT happens when a monster attacks."

A fight happens when you encounter a monster. Whether the monster approached you, or you approached it first, is irrelevant. Though usually it is us who do the walking, so I'd say it is the latter.

"That's exactly what they DO in the genocide route. I don't see the issue."

Then what about any other route? And why set up puzzles when you can barricade the roads so that the human doesn't escape, something we've been over already? Though... I forgot what I'm on about here.

"First, HER words. That was Undyne speaking."

Ok.

"My point was that the monster attacks were trying to kill you."

Well yes. Monster attack on a human soul does hurt. But the intentions of the monsters themselves are more questionable.

"He just chooses not to, because, as he says, you can't attack him there."

That's how I meant it.

"Besides, why do the bridges have railings if this is true?"

Well, not everyone has got the HUD after all.

"That way, no human can cross, because of the boundaries!"

Exactly, why can't they just barricade the roads?

"Um, it's NOT. I already TOLD you that's not how it works. All it does is send everyone back in time. The deja-vu moments is a direct result of that."

That's the SLR system. I'm talking about the battle interface itself. The SLR is 100% canon the way it is, minus the menu and death screens, in my opinion at least.

"Or, that's not how it works at all, because there's no mind control involved!"

But would have to be, if not everyone sees it. Since that would be the only way to explain why the monsters don't react, et cetera et cetera.

"By giving humans an immense advantage, making their attacks invisible to monsters, allowing them to pretty much one-shot nearly every monster in the war, without a single human getting killed?"

But why give the monsters a chance to attack at all, why not ensure the hit never misses, and why move the soul into the battle rectangle at all? That would have been far better for them.

"Simultaneity still exists."

No, it doesn't. It's a turn after turn when that system is active. Even overworld dialogue, by the looks of it. The amalgamates are an exception to that rule though.

"Not when you take into consideriation that hey, maybe the monsters don't have a reason to be suprised, and they're familiar with it just like we're familiar with natural events!"

Then explain where this familiarity came from already.

"There's no simulteneity halt. You just can't reach the button."

And that's what I'm talking about. Instead of being freely able to touch the monsters - attack them, your soul gets stuck in a system where you can't do anything, and can only use weapons given to you - the fight button. Next, you can't do anything on a monster's turn but to dodge. And the monster could also attack you when it's your turn, but cannot. And that's not because they can't get the soul, we saw that Undyne's spears can damage physical matter, so she could theoretically summon some and hurt our physical body, but didn't. So monsters too are locked from doing anything with our bodies. Of course, Sans found a way around all of that, by attacking the soul outside the designated battle 'arena', but nevermind him for now.

"Meaning it was a part of the universe from the start. Just like all these artificial-looking laws in our world."

That's not what artificial means. But just for fun, name one such law.

"And they've been shown to have some influence at times."

The HUD registers their name as the former owner of the save power. That's all. They have no influence on any other but the genocide route. We thought our character is a player insert, but then we find out that they have their own name, their own story. We didn't get to choose that for them, we only guided them through. Maybe, our input was Chara's commands, you could have that head canon.

"Perhaps later on, he noted that even after he found out you weren't Chara, he felt Chara"

There's nothing to indicate that he "felt" their presence.

"This was before he turned back into Flowey in the later scene."

He gave the souls away, he doesn't have the power, he doesn't have an infinite HP. His form is just a projection, a lingering effect provided by the souls he no longer has.

"We always get HP."

INFINITE HP.

"It'd be a common thing taught when fighting humans, especially since this is also their ONLY attack."

Well not everyone was taught to fight humans, were they?

"Lemon Bread broke that "law" too. We also did that in Papyrus' fight."

Those were the monsters themselves changing it. But if you think about it, it makes sense from a non-meta point of view. The amalgamate removed space by closing their jaw. Papyrus made you able to fly, ergo your space grew in size. Sans, he had no reason to let you move your own box though.

"Which confirms not everyone wants to kill you."

Good.

"Free can mean death too, you know. Free from the mortal realm."

Well that doesn't make much sense outside the context of the genocide route, does it?

"I compared it to a branch of physical science, and said this deep into tye HUD is a mystery that we can't solve, just like before the Big Bang."

Yeah. Only, the big bang is very simple, while this thing is awfully specific in pretty much everything and requires lots of context. It's not a good analogy.