Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-26006155-20181123023529/@comment-26006155-20181212001356

Replying to Ambassador:

While it’s true that Flowey can mimic voices, and has limited shapeshift abilities like changing his face early on, he only ever uses voices he’s heard before.

The voice in the elevator is one Frisk never remembers hearing.. (remember, he has amnesia) but one that says “It’s been a long time”. It hasn’t been a long time since Frisk met Flowey, Flowey’s been following him his entire journey.

This voice sounds like a mastermind pulling the strings. And also someone who would rather send a creature after Frisk than fight Frisk themselves. Flowey/Asriel has no trouble confronting Frisk directly.

---

Don’t forget that even if you reload, some characters remember what you did. The creepiest thing I’ve seen in any video game is when I accidentally killed Toriel, reloaded, then spared her, only to have Flowey reform her face and says “YOU KILLED HER”. Creatures with human souls like Frisk, Flowey and Sans remember what you’ve done.

And we’re dealing with a situation where two humans with Determination are in conflict. Flowey notes Chara-possessed Frisk has greater determination than he does, blocking his own ability to save. It’s hard to judge the exact rules without more examples of this. Perhaps Sans couldn’t reload, and had to save after The Darkest Experiment.

Flowey’s DT was lesser than Frisk’s, but Omega Flowey’s was greater. Perhaps one can become more powerful by absorbing souls. And if Gaster had done that before his conflict with Sans, then Sans couldn’t load out of it.

-

Option D: Just taking a monster soul and going back to the surface, would actually be really easy for Gaster since he wouldn’t need to kill Asgore or Toriel, but could use his Determination Extraction technology to steal the soul of any lesser monster.

However, there are problems with this. Gaster traveled with Sans, and would have to get Sans through the barrier too. And when presented with the option of absorbing a monster soul.. Sans might not like the idea. AT ALL.

Then there’s the problem of a massive monster civilization living underground that’s slowly amassing the power of 7 human souls, with the intention of then breaking out of the Underground and destroying all human civilization with godlike powers. To simply leave such a time bomb ticking underground is.. Irresponsible when you’re one of the humans who might be on the receiving end later.

And then, the monsters are a source of scientific potential. They can use magic. They can be turned into horrifying amalgamated abominations. Their souls can be harvested by humans and used to greatly augment their own powers. There’s no way a mad scientist can be presented with an opportunity like this, and not want to at least keep SOME of monsterkind around, safely contained in a lab, as promising material for all their other projects.

Gaster could have left, but didn’t. There were too many reasons to stay.

-

You do have a point that in “going back” Sans might be talking about time rather than space.

But Sans still has access to the time/space portal Gaster built into The Core. If Sans simply wanted to time-travel within the Underground/Ruins.. He could. And has.

But Sans is a human. Wherever or whenever it was that he wanted to return to, it isn’t this place, and it isn’t somewhere he can currently reach, likely because of the Barrier. And while most of monsterkind longs to return to the surface, Sans is mysteriously un-enthusiastic about this idea.

About Sans saying nothing matters because of the reset:

Sans has had the capacity to simply bail on this timeline and move to another one where Papyrus is still alive, this entire time.

Why does Sans stay and fight Chara-possessed Frisk? Because Sans cares. About Frisk.

Even when Sans dunks on Frisk, he knows Frisk will just reset. And he wants to get Frisk so frustrated that he’ll quit. “If we’re really friends.. You won’t come back!”

Sans tells Frisk that there’s no benefit whatsoever for him to continue. And he knows that if Frisk does get taken over completely by Chara, Frisk will lose his soul. FOREVER. And not ever resetting can undo that. A consequence that DOES persist across time and space.

So Sans does everything he can to turn Frisk from this path, get him to quit, outlast him.. But in the end Frisk’s Determination prevails.

And as Chara later points out.. This very Determination was the player’s doom.

-

About the Objection on Frisk teleporting:

Why would Sans, who is very clearly trying to actually kill Frisk in the Megalovania fight, deliberately teleport Frisk to safety in a situation where damage was certain?

And Sans does make sure that wherever Frisk ends up, there’s a horde of Gaster Blasters waiting for him, or another Wario-ware like situation where Frisk must react IMMEDIATELY to avoid getting wrecked.

Why doesn’t Sans teleport? Well, keep in mind the game prevents us from ever seeing what it looks like when Sans teleports, so he never does it when we’re watching. Dodging, though, is kind of a stand-in. We need an explanation for why Sans can flawlessly dodge Frisk’s attacks, but not Chara’s.

-

I covered why Sans is the perfect judge in the script addition above