Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-31981697-20170722123329/@comment-32182236-20171018193845

Nice one for pointing out it's not a mushroom. Well, let's just say the symbol now. You'll probably know which symbol I mean...

Also, the only "whole" game 2015 Toby ever made is Undertale. This is 211X Toby. A game could have been mad during the century time-gap. Besides, this is an AU Toby, therefore, not everything Toby does is accurately reflected in the game, and vice versa. After all, Toby's not a dog in real life-That alone is enough to prove it's not IRL Toby. And technically, if we look strictly at the empirical evidence, and not what the fans made out, all the room REALLY hints at is it being a dog developer's room, that he's sleeping on a rug that needs to be patched, and barked at a computer screen to make a game-Not 2015 Toby. Remember, Undertale happens in 211X. Frisk enters the room. Therefore, the room happens in 211X, so the dog must ALSO be in 211X. We can't put vague similarities ABOVE concrete fact and logic.

Also, the paradox is that the computer the dog supposedly used to make Undertale didn't exist yet, because it is a part of Undertale. Now, if you wish to drop Undertale canonically being a game, and say Undertale's a game that exists inside the world, separate from OUR Undertale (making the game sort of like how past events are told into stories, except here, the author actually talking about making that book at the end), then we can actually solve the paradox this way. But we can't say that the Annoying Dog canonically created the universe as a game using a computer that didn't exist yet, because there was no universe, and therefore, no computer. Computers can't create themselves, and this argument suggests one did. Now do you see the problem?

Common sense also tells us that an object cannot be in two places at the same time, with multiple speeds at the same time. And we both know THAT'S wrong. (Quantum mechanics anyone?) The only facts are what we directly observe. It being a "reference to Toby" is technically not a fact, and we need to explain all the facts, instead of just ignoring them. If that means ignoring well-established headcanons, then so be it-Empirical evidence takes priority. Headcanons are assumptions we make-That's all a headcanon really is. Canon is what's been established explicitly. Fanon is a headcanon that's so popular that the fandom that (near) consensually agrees upon. We can't ignore empirical evidence, that is against the nature of science, and the scientific method. We can't use confirmation bias- We must take into consideration ALL the evidence. Ignoring the evidence-THAT is changing facts, or in this case, REMOVING facts. Once again, the only facts are what the game explicitly shows happen, and things that can be proven from then. Proven, not inferred. All we're doing here is altering inferences- the actual source, the fact, is not altered. Just like all the evidence must fit in the real world, all the evidence must fit in Undertale, as is. We can add headcanons in an attempt to explain them, but we cannot call said headcanons as equal to the evidence, unless we prove they're the only possibility tbat explains all the evidence. We CANNOT take any evidence away, or alter it. For example, I can't say that Frisk does NOT flirt with Papyrus in the True Pacifist Route, but instead insults him-That's altering evidence, because in order to trigger the TP Route, we HAVE to flirt with Papyrus.

Actually, we don't know what the developer's will is-We're just making up his will, and using that as evidence that a certain theory is true... Yeah, let's stick with empirical evidence. Now, let's look at your line of reasoning.

"if that dog is supposed to represent him, then it cannot NOT be him"

As I pointed out, Toby's not a dog IRL. This is an AU Toby. Perhaps how Toby imagines he would be like if he was a monster-I'm not sure, because we don't know his will-We do know it's an AU Toby, though.

"And if it must be Toby, then the stuff related to this dog must be about Toby too, meaning, more non-canon things that are not worth theorizing about"

Technically, it's about an AU 211X Toby. Remember, the game happens in 211X, not 2015. And Toby existing doesn't make stuff non-canon. We must take ALL empirical evidence into account. There are no contradictions between the evidence, we CAN fit them all together into a story.