Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-34020894-20180208150936

'''You'll know that asriel and chara dreemurr from undertale are two best friends: one a sweet innocent goat bro while the other a mysterious cyric human child. There both valued members of the monster community and care about one another(enough that one would die for the other). But have you even though that two of the main characters that are similar(in a way) to them? Two people who they show fondness in several ways…'''

I’m talking about papyrus(asriel) and undyne(chara). They’re both best friends, goof off together and have important roles in undertale .Through some dialogue and runs in game and other sources, it looks like asriel(or fowey) has a liking for papyrus and chara as a liking to undye. In the fandom they tend to be portray as idoles/inspiration to the kids, it’s very cute concept and i can see it. Here are the similar of them

Please note: 

1. We don't know much about chara and asriel in game(outside of the story and appearance), so we just going to use secondary sources for their personality.

2.you don’t need to take this seriously, As its more headcanon/speculation than fact.

'''3. If you don’t like it, here a tip AVOID THIS CRINGY POST...okay? Okay.'''

Papyrus and Asriel/Flowey


 * 1) hey’re both innocent and kind-hearted

'''Okay let's be serious with this, papyrus is, by far the nicest monster in the underground (considering what their souls are made of). He may have a ego and a brash personality sometimes but it balances with his big heart(or soul). He just wants to help his friends in some way and gives helpful advice to others, he as faith in everyone even the nastiest of people. If you go on a playdate with him in the neutral run(when you don’t flirt with him) he advise you to grow your friendship level and to do it for your sake not his.'''

'''On undyne date, he tricks undyne to befriend us but using versephyologic or after alphys date where he told us to visit the lab to learn the truth(yes, flowey made him do it, but still their training ended really early). Hell he gives us emotional support in some of the phonecalls'''

'''He very innocent too, he has a lot of goofy antics and humorous puzzles and japes are what makes him so lovable for most players. In the Snowdin arc where we meet the brothers, you’re easily amused or annoyed by their interactions or how incompetent the puzzles and attempts to capture us are. he may be a bit childish, but he’s far from stupid as he shown with some signs of intelligence and he has dreams of wanted to ride a car or have his face carve in a bush(god he  dreams big) '''

'''Now it asriel's turn, and once again while we don’t know much about him it make sense he would be a sweet innocent kid in the pre-game area.both his parents are shown to be kind and good people so he must have be raised that way. In the beginning he help human(the species that wiped out his own kind) to his home and be friended it. Asriel is the prince of monster so he would know stories of the war between humans and monster, but chara was hurt and scared from the fall he just lend a helping hand.'''

'''His kind nature even extent from the plan and as flowey. They sibling made a plan to kill themselves and collects 6 souls to break the barrier. He didn’t feel comfortable with it but goes along with it for his friends sake, he cares about chara, more to the point of following along. He had comforted and reassure them toward the short life(and they must have had a hard time on the surface). '''

'''Speaking of which, a lot of people forget that flowey didn’t start out awful(or how flowey and asriel are the same) remember how he cried for his parents and learn he doesn’t feel love, tried to kill himself and tried to be good with his power. He was once kinded and can feel love, now his murderous and numb to compassion. '''


 * 1) They’re both have morality and would never kill

'''Papyrus is the only monster in game that doesn’t kill you in a battle(yes even goat mom kills us by mistake). When he attacks our hp reduce to one and puts us in a shed into rest(which we can escape from). It not until you die thrice or survived his attacks that he spares you. Papyrus has amazing control of his magic, even toriel won’t have, Undyne even mentions that papyrus is tough than he looks but would hurt a fly.'''

'''In the genocide, doesn’t even tried to attack us like in the other runs. He tried to spared us. Yep, this skeleton after finding out that a human was murdering everything they see wants to give them guiding to be a better person. I mean no offense but most sociopaths/psychopaths won’t hesitate to kill the innocents, and they either become helpless and run away, That takes guts and moral bravery to stand up to them. Hell, he even said he would’ve use his special attack have we not spare him.'''

'''Asriel, in a way is the same. When his sibling was to use their full power on humans, he resisted. Had he not do that it would have started a war either way considering the circumstance. Asriel was born by the time the monster were trapped in the underground, so he probably doesn’t know much about the outside/humans beside knowledge of the elders/parents. '''

'''Chara doesn’t have a good time on the surface so they must have told him so bad things, but asriel must have believe that not all humans are awful(especially since their sibling is good/neutral). We even prove this to him in the end of a pacific run, by sparing all those monsters and trying to save him. We teach him how his way was right and he no longer blames himself for that decision. Which was the right thing to do.'''

'''he then admits to his mistakes and sacrificed his happiness for frisk and others. This scene kinda of redemp both flowey and asriel for the sins they made, he’s been through so much grief and trauma his whole life, doesn’t have the life a normal kid would. But thanks to us, his finally about to let go of the pain. He even give us one good advice and message for us in the end.'''


 * 1) Lack any friends but are important to the underground

'''The reason papyrus wants to capture you is so he can become popular and earn friends. Sans mention how papyrus being feeling lonely and ask you to humor him with his puzzles. He grows fond of you over time and even refuse to fight you out of pity. All he wants is a friend like him. It saids he have a few friends though(sans, undyne and in extend flowey) and the people of snowdin are fond of him and his brother but it doesn’t see like anyone spend times with him that much.(not wonder he wants to be a royal guard so badly).'''

'''Speaking of the monsters, did you know in most neutral runs when you kill papyrus(whether or not you killed other monsters too) you are been seen as a threat to the millions of monsters. The people of snowdin won't be devastated, sans would be absent, undyne would hate you more and you won't be able to do specific task or dates with anyone. You have to befriend papyrus first if you want to get the true ending. Without him we wont have been able befriend the other characters.'''

'''Once again, we don’t know much about asriel before his death. But it’s safe to assume that he barely has any friends before he meet chara. When he came back as a flower the only persons he run to were his parents,He don’t go to anyone else for love as far as the story goes. I mean one can assume his friends were fallen down, if so why not mention them or bring them back(he would have had someone to understand his situation). The way he cling to chara and his memories of them like a thirst yandere, as both form mind you, shows that there the only friend he had(before we can down) and even though he can’t feel love he just wants to see them again.'''

​
 * 1) Flowey and Papyrus

'''Now it been going around in the community that flowey and papyrus has a ‘special’ connection, whether it’s platonic or sinister (i for one find it adorable/creepy at the same time). As said earlier, flowey has done pacific runs before a genocide. What not to say he didn’t befriend papyrus, he did give his advice, encouragement and such according to sans.'''

'''In the neutral playthrough, if you reload multiple times there are some hidden messages from flowey. One of them being about papyrus and sans, while flowey fears sans, he sees his brother(papyrus) as a better characters to messy with. He even mentions the ‘flowey fan club’ so to speak. And the way he looks when mentioning papyrus looks like guilt/trying to be pleased or something, one of the times we see that face would be the genocide run where we hear his story(and somewhere else i don't remember).'''

'''Papyrus does see flowey as his friend, bluntly obilovs to his nature(ha! another one). in the many phone call with papyrus he mentions a flower even display some traits/quotes that can be identified as flowey however nobody seem to know or believe him meaning paps is the only one who knows him(This pointing my previous statement).'''

'''In the genocide, flowey says that he use his power for good before doing things bad, and after a while he got bored of both and probably let time move on. What not to say in his good runs he befriend papyrus right(like in our pacific run) he did learn everything the world has to offer(that includes people ). Also in the anniversary q&a, no knows papyrus favourite dish(even him) while flowey knows(hmmm?)'''

Undyne and Chara


 * 1) They both hate humanity

'''Now if you’re a chara defender like me, you know that chara shows so admiration for our heroine, no matter the run. They’re silent like their parents in neutral run where she slowly fading away or the kill-all run(where they’re sadistic) where undyne revived toward determination. And like asriel/flowey and papyrus, they share some things in common, example being there hated for humanity. '''

'''When we first meet her she was so held beneath on killing us, even if papyrus tried to talk to her about it. Undyne is the captain of the royal guard and her job is to capture or kill the human that pass by. She doesn’t really care if we were merciful or if we save monster kid, all she know is that we’re the last soul needed for the barrier. Undyne is a very passionate person and has a vendetta against humans, and who can blame her? Humans are the ones who took away their freedom and murder the prince of monsters, there bring her kind nothing but despair so it make sense she won’t trust us.'''

'''It also stems in neutral runs too. she calls you out on the deads of monster you killed, making it harder to befriend her later. In the Betrayed Undyne Ending she blames us for the murders and plans for revenges if you don’t befriend her. And if you did and kill afterwards, she feels hurt and betrayed and when queened she’s more devoted to the war than asgore was. The only way to win her trust is to show her the good side of humans, which is by dating with her and showing your pacifisting. Asgore taught her the value of pacifism, which is why Undyne sees the ust as a wimpy loser with a big heart.It’s very hard to befriend her without kill monsters since she’s the protector of them'''

'''Now chara’s hated of humans is a different story. We know in the end of the pacifist run, asriel says they hated humans, while it’s never stated why they were very strong about it though. Now remember with chara we have no idea what they are like or why they hate human, but there reason varies among many things: abuse, neglect, grief, etc. they say they climb the mountain for an unhappy reason,mainly because of the way humans treat them. I think reason chara run away from home is because of how horrible humanity is. the surface world is different from the underground, taking it real life there are heartless people out, and they’re not easy to reason with. And knowing the war between humans and monster and what souls are made of it does paint humans in a negative light, that would probably make their hate swell bad to the point of constructing the plan(which will talk about later)'''

'''However we can convince them that there is hope for humanity thou. If you play frisk in the pacifist and spare monsters, you showed them that asriel was right for sparing the humans in the past. Their flavor text becomes cheerful, caring and humorous through our journey and we’ll be able to give both kids peace in the end. If we kill even one person they become pessimistic, they express grief, sadness and failure of their past and believe they were right for killing even in self defense. Then in the kill-all-run, they become the heartless killer people sometimes portrays them as and K I L L  E V E R Y T H I N G. you should them that humans are the really monster and there’s be no hope for you in the long run.'''


 * 1) They both very determined and will never give up

'''Now we all know that undyne is the most determined monster in the underground. She very passionate about the things she do and will stand firm on her beliefs no matter what. Which is why she too stubborn to show mercy to us. She the only one to possess her own determination(unless the amalgamates) as shown in the no-mercy run where after getting killed in one blow, she reforms to a stronger version of her form in order to defend monsters(and humans). SHE’S THE HEROINE THAT NEVER GIVE UP. she fights for everyone's hopes and dreams, she pushes herself to great limits to murder you(even if opticals provide her). She smiles and laughs in the face of death or pain. She won’t give up without a fight.'''

'''Chara is a human, and what are humans made of...DETERMINATION. It allows those the willpower to achieve their goals no matter what. In the tapes in the true lab, chatra sounds very determined to collect the souls for the barrier, even so as to pressure asriel into their creepy plan to kill themselves so he can absorb their soul.in the game over screen, lines also tells us to stay determined after when die. This looks like something chara been told by their fathers in their life and death. '''

'''In the No-Mercy run, after killing monsters in one area, their narraction saids in red determination, indicating your willingness to finish the job you started. While the determination isn’t theirs, you teach them that killing is the right way to go and it’s what awakes them from death.'''


 * 1) They love monsters and will sacrificed for their loved ones

'''As stated before, undyne is the protector of monster kind. She will defend any monster from whatever threat is wondering in the underground and is show to help people in their time of need(e.p. alphys,syrine,blooky,monster kid). There’s a reason why she never put Papyrus in the royal guard, guards/warriors whatever don’t just fight but kill their enemies. she knows he’ll never hurt people as papy fight fair, that why she teaches him cooking in hopes for him to find something else to do(even if she’s terrible at it)'''

'''She wants to free monsters from the prison the humans put them. Once again since she’s the royal guard and know the history of humans and monsters, toward waterfall or alphys books(even if they were just anime) it make sense that she would rather sacrificed herself for the people she care about. She devoted like that. Even in defeat she still has hope things will get better. she smiles to death in the end, believing that asgore will asbored the souls and kill us(even if that not ture.=) ).'''

'''Even though chara hates humans, it’s never been stated that they hate monster or their new family. While at face value chara seem to be a creepy “evil” child with a twisted mind/plan, there are also evidence in the game to suggest that they care for the Dreemurrs. Chara is said by their father to be “the hope of humans and monsters” because of their love for monsters(but not humans thou). if chara’s the narrator(wich i firmly believe) she gives us information about specific monsters we encountered through the runs, meaning they must have met or learn about different monster in the underground. No evidence points to chara hating monsters(exactly since monster were the only ones to show them kindness).'''


 * 1) Not the greatest but are still friendly people

'''As stated before undyne can be a very aggressive person when push comes to shove. In the beginning of the waterfall arc, monster kid show some affection/idolizing of undyne. like everyone in the underground, he looks up to her as all great hero out to stop the bad guys(which she still is). Of course he doesn’t know there are bad traits about her, like her hatred for humans. It’s common for children to look up to people as all mighty, whether it be your friends, family or people you know, and never see the flaws in them. But they eventually learn there not as good as they’re make out to be. Which monster kid did at the end of the Mercy Run.'''

'''Same knowledge applies with asriel to chara. I said before that asriel barely have any friends as show in almost all the runs, and in everyone run asriel/flowey expects chara to be as heartless as he is since they lost their souls. To asriel they’re special to him, only one who understand them, he cares alot. Of course he does recognise they were the greatest until the end, where he admits they’re not perfect and was able to move on from them.'''

'''Of course these things don’t stop they from being or trying to be good people. As said before they care about the people they love and will go to great lengths to do anything for them. They’re not all good nor all bad, but they learn their lessons sooner or later. And yes mk and asriel find different people to look up to but it doesn’t stop them from hating their former friends. Everyone in undertale as problems/flaws but we have the determination to redeem ourselves. '''

Conclusion

'''But anyway yeah there are alot of in-game parallels between papyrus and asriel and undyne and chara. Both kids have striking resembles to two enthusiastic buddies. They are exactly what both kids want to be had they not died. If they didn’t do the plan or got resurrected(somehow?) they would grow up to be just like them and learn a few things too.'''

'''I mean, there are striking similarities between these two, but these are just my thought and i would love to hear yours. What do you people think. Like and reblog if you must and if i miss anything let me know okay.'''

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