Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-27089028-20160805195911/@comment-27089028-20160805210307

Mabian wrote: Can I get some clarification on the line of Chara calling Frisk their reincarnaton? I'm wracking my brain trying to remember where that occurs, and nothing is coming up. Chara literally says that they realize the purpose of their reincarnation, but that doesn't suggest that Frisk is their reincarnated self. (I've always tried pushing the idea that Chara is actually talking to Frisk at the end of the Genocide route, and not the player, as the dialogue and choices make no sense if the player is the object.)

With respect to monsters in general, one of the things from the Snowdin Library is that monster souls are closely tied to their bodies, in contrast to humans. Which gets us to their "essence" being preserved. What that "essence" means in terms of retaining identity is unclear.

Flowey can be seen either as Asriel without the capacity to feel (and of course trapped in a flower), or as a new entity that has the memories of Asriel, but isn't ​actually ​Asriel. When we go back in the Epilogue to talk to Asriel, he sort of pushes us in both directions, talking about his actions as a flower as though they were ​his ​decisions, while also saying that when we see him as Flowey, that we should "not think of it as [him]."

There's a lot of philosophical debate on the nature of identity, and I think part of the problem of trying to solve the problem in this game is that Toby isn't really taking part in that debate. There are small pieces that make the general story consistent, but it doesn't tell us anything about the true nature of identity (at least in Toby's eyes) to allow us to use these broader concepts. So either take on what Flowey really is becomes equally viable, since there's nothing to give us any clues as to what is the "proper" version. It would seem odd to use the word reincarnation and not apply it to the context of the game. Like I said Narrator Chara theory still works as Buddhist reincarnation does not mean Chara is Frisk or Vice Versa.

Monster's definition of essence is a little blurry but Flowey gives it more sense in his words, existence and actions. It does seem odd how Flowey's nature has contradictions but alas if Soul is what Flowey said it is then Flowey as it stands is not the same entity as Asriel.

I think Toby's methods are similar to Scott Cawthon's in that regard: hinting at what lies behind the mystery but never indulging.