Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-39385741-20200106144455/@comment-39385741-20200107003929

A few hours after posting this discussion, there's suddenly a ton of long replies on it. Huh.

Okay, let's take this one reply at a time.

For Jacky720's first reply:

Okay, you have some pretty good points here. But:


 * First of all, you didn't have to be so harsh. It was just an idea that I decided to post here to see what people think.
 * "Plus, Flowey has no SOUL, and he can SAVE." Flowey probably had enough DT put into him to match the amount that a red SOUL has.
 * "This is in strong opposition of the "red is Determination" theory, since Chara had a red SOUL, and was apparently not determined." Well then, how about let's change it around. Instead of being determined to live, Chara was determined to die.
 * "No we don't. Now we have three facts, and zero conclusions." Well, I think it's a pretty good theory. Zero conclusions?! Read the title! That's the conclusion! Theories aren't supposed to be canon. They're supposed to be an idea that could be canon.
 * "'Perhaps' again. It's about as likely as the alternative." And you are right. Again, this is just an idea, which is the reason why I said things like "maybe" and "perhaps".
 * "You have several opinions, 5 facts, and no conclusions. You do not have a theory." Actually, no opinions. Just some facts and educated guesses that help my conclusion, which is that the red soul MIGHT be determination.
 * Also, you are kinda being a little rude, you know. "You do not have a theory" Jeez! It was just an idea!

For PersonThePerson's reply:

Well, sorry. I can't. I'm kinda new to theories, so I thought I could just give a statement with a ton of evidence, and then it would be a good theory.

For Tyssx's reply:

"you have dismissed the Toriel argument by saying that she was just getting Chara flashbacks, despite this being similar to the deja vu moments that all the other main characters got regarding Frisk."

Okay, please stop being so hard on me, it was JUST AN IDEA that I decided to post here, and I guess I didn't consider some things.

"Your theory is missing a point. You are aiming to present a logical explanation for the theory that red is determination (even though many people got the same idea and used the exact same arguments as you many times before, but whatevs, you didn't know that), but you didn't explain why!"

I thought of the idea, thought about it some more, and it turned into a theory. That's why. And I have seen the arguments used before, I brought them up in the theory because it wouldn't have made sense without them.

"My guess would be that you wanted to make Frisk a special snowflake. A perfect person or even a hero, who faced all kinds of odds and emerged victorious, and that it was all thanks to their little red superpower."

I'm sorry, what?! A "special snowflake"? No.

"That's the usual take that people have when they present this red = DT theory. So, is it true? Is this the reason why you prefer your own theory over the other one? I do admit, the other one, that Frisk is not special in any way at all, is rather boring, and it kinda takes away the spice from the overall game, but then again, the opposite, your argument, it actually also takes the spice away, but in a slightly different way."

What? Why do you think I want to make Frisk more special or interesting? I wasn't even considering Frisk much when I made this theory. I just wanted to figure out what the red SOUL is.

"Assume that Frisk is the perfect hero, who can defeat any adversary through the power of their heightened DT. Okay, so... was the final battle against Asriel pointless? Maybe the battle against photoshop Flowey was, but this one... Toby obviously painted it so epic, with the music, and the colors, and the edgy flavor text and quotes... Was that really a guise? Did we misinterpret his intent? Did he actually want to paint the battle as a wimpy attempt by Asriel to overpower a literal DT-God? I don't think so."

Again, you're confusing me. Just becuase Frisk has determination doesn't mean they can, "defeat any adversary" with it! "DT-God"?! The only thing determination gives you is the power to SAVE!

"But even if it's true, even if Frisk's soul is stronger than other human souls and weaker than 7 human souls overall, then... what's the point, honestly? What's the point of making their soul SLIGHTLY stronger than a regular soul, plot-wise?"

It doesn't have to be slightly stronger. It just has to be > 1 and < 7.

"Are you just trying to make Frisk a special snowflake, but this time for no reason at all? At least the people who believe that their soul was stronger than Asriel's 7 souls did so because they saw that Frisk's DT overpowered Asriel's (as Asriel couldn't reset without first killing Frisk), so they thought that Frisk's soul is indeed that strong. At least their shitty take is based in something tangible, something that could be considered canon."

And there you are again with the "special snowflake" thing. I do NOT consider Frisk a "special snowflake", they're nowhere NEAR the top of my favorite Undertale character list.

"But what do YOU have? For what reason do you insist that Frisk's soul is more powerful than other kinds of souls? If it really is that Frisk is a special snowflake to you, WITHOUT circularly arguing that it is, because..."

NO. He is not my "special snowflake". I do not consider Frisk's SOUL more powerful than the othert SOULs, I said that the red SOUL had more determination than the others, just like the green SOUL has more kindness, the light blue SOUL has more patience, etc. Frisk's SOUL just happens to be the one without a trait. I do not consider Frisk my "special snowflake".

"I diagnose you with Frisk-crush syndrome. You are wracked with a perverted sentimentality about a fictional character and you can't help to stop daydreaming about them being a hero of your fantasies."

Hmm... Wrong character.

For Jacky720's second reply:

I have nothing to say about this reply.

For DocMelonhead's relpy:

What KockaAdmiralac said.